WarhammerSide - An interesting set of ideas

[Ludicrouse]

Thanks to Bags for finding this little gem (http://www.warhammeralliance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=188119).

It is a discussion about the implementation of some of PlanetSide's greatest features into WAR. Well worth a look and a post if you miss some of the fantastic features PlanetSide had.

[BlueFlower]

love it!

would love to see localized spawn points.

teleporters would be cool also.

Would be great if Mythic saw this post and took notes.

edit: Is there currently a way to "starve out" a base. Cut off its supply route as u would in planetside when u drain its NTU. Cos thats something that would be cool imo. Then when the base is empty of supplies the NPCs die.

[PariaH]

erm i think thats taking things a little too literally, guarding postern doors would be the closest thing to draining a base. :D

the first thing i would like to see would be guild recall scrolls that took you back to a keep if you had actually claimed it, meaning you could rally the entire guild to defend a keep under attack within a few minutes.

There was talk of being able to bolster a keeps defences through ownership, even if its just extra siege pads / better oil / stronger door - something that gives you more of an incentive to claim keeps (and more guild xp!).

And definitely some system that rewards defenders for defending a keep, it has got marginally better since release - maybe some pq chest that spawned if you managed to hold a keep under attack for a set period of time, right now the most popular tactics seems to be zerg each others empty keeps for loot and avoid each other where possible.

[Skullsmasher]

Gief transport Rolf-copter!! :p

[Hovis]

The bugbear for sieges right now is the distance attackers have to walk. They should just let you slap down a spawn point on a ranged attack pod. A healer tent or something. The defenders could whack it, so you'd have to pin them down, but it'd be better than nothing.

[GuardianAnge1]

haven't played WAR, but from the sounds of it, they didn't do proper research when designing the keep sieges.

Planetside had a winning forumla

[Ludicrouse]

haven't played WAR, but from the sounds of it, they didn't do proper research when designing the keep sieges.

Planetside had a winning forumla

So the past 7 years of DAOC where what exactly?

[Hovis]

So the past 7 years of DAOC were what exactly?

They were ignored, apparently.

[GuardianAnge1]

They were ignored, apparently.

evidently.. if people are already complaining about a key feature, especially one which has been "RnD'd for 7 years" there is obviously a problem.

[Ludicrouse]

evidently.. if people are already complaining about a key feature, especially one which has been "RnD'd for 7 years" there is obviously a problem.

I dont think anyone is complaining about the Siege Warfare, quite the opposite. If you had actually read the link that was provided then you would have noticed that they were ideas to improve and not requests for wide sweeping changes.

Maybe you should actually try this feature before you critic it, you never know, you may enjoy it?

[Hovis]

I'm a little worried about this talk that sieges were a beta addition though. I mean just what did they think people would do all day?

They need to be careful taking too much from PS though. Damage levels are massively lower in WAR than in PS, takes ages to kill anything by comparison and the whole combat dynamic is different. I mean people in that thread were talking about corridors as a good thing. Maybe they are in an FPS with, you know, GUNS, but in a melee and magic game they'd be completely crap.

[Ludicrouse]

I'm a little worried about this talk that sieges were a beta addition though.

They received alot of "inhouse" testing and really all that was missing was the Keep itself from the map.

[GuardianAnge1]

Maybe you should actually try this feature before you critic it, you never know, you may enjoy it?

As I said, I havent played the game and am not planning on doing so. I read the whole of the OP and from the sounds of it, the siege battles don't seem to be that great. There is obviously a lot I don't know about WAR, but from what I read, they probably could have done a better job.

[Gunhead]

True that Bread, though i really think they could do with more complexity or at least SOME variation on the keep designs. As is - like someone pointed in that thread - it's pretty much: bang on a door until it's down, bang on another door until it's down as well, squeeze through the stairwell chokepoint to lord's chamber, kill lord. That's it. There's a flat zero of alternative ways as that's how you do it, period.

Now any of you who've been to e.g. the big PQ/quest keep in Talabecland can imagine how much more interesting a siege would be if that was the size and layout of an RvR keep. Or take even one of the tall watch towers in the same zone: that'd be one hell of a cool setting to fight over floor by floor.

Not only are some juicy possibilities for alternate and varying RvR keep battles possible they're already IN the game, just not in the right places.

edit: hum, think i'll add that to the WHA thread - just incase Powers That Be are watching it.

[Ludicrouse]

As I said, I havent played the game and am not planning on doing so. I read the whole of the OP and from the sounds of it, the siege battles don't seem to be that great. There is obviously a lot I don't know about WAR, but from what I read, they probably could have done a better job.

You read wrong, very wrong. The siege warfare is awesome and i dont see how they could have done a better job before release. It merely suffers from what Planetside did, lack of variation in design.

[Hovis]

Gunhead is right. There are some brilliant combat areas in the game. Do they ever see any action? Do they hell. I would say nearly all the combat happens in or just outside the cookie-cutter keeps. This is not the end of the world though because the zones are built. They just need to refine the system.

There are a lot of pretty serious problems with the RvR though, hence why I'm taking a break until they patch it. They need to work on having ways for people to deploy rapidly to defend keeps and they need to work on reducing the amount of NPCs involved in a keep defence. The fundamentals of the keep battles are really solid though, that's the most important thing.

What I'd like to see added are new ways into the keeps. I'd go for just making the Positern door breakable using regular attacks, so it takes ages to bring down, and perhaps adding a sewer or well or something access, because that could be an instance so they would only have to add openings to the actual map.

[Daymare]

hehe "if I worked for mythic i would"

1- Add evolving keeps: Instead of having keeps increase in size as you increase your tier, they should increase in size as they were held for longer at a time. Tiers could also be a defining factor, for example tier one only had a circle at the start, while tier four would give you a starting set of palisades.
This would give players an incentive to constantly swap targets instead of randomly zerg.

2- New battlefield objectives, example:
-Diggers den (enemy holds this, they get a timer that when it hits zero, they get an underground entrance to the castle) if friendlies hold it, it will increase rate of keep evolution.
-Lumbermill (enemies hold it, it starts to build a siege tower that can give you extra access points, but that can be destroyed)
-Munition depot (increases damage of siege engines)
-Etc etc

3- Add capturable spawnpoints (this is given, it makes no sense not to have it)

4- add grapling hooks that can support one player to climb it, and that can be torn loose, giving melee more stuff to do.

I can go on, but I felt I spammed too much randomness already :)
Want to buy job :p

[Khammar]

Good stuff Day.

[Ludicrouse]

Gunhead is right. There are some brilliant combat areas in the game. Do they ever see any action? Do they hell. I would say nearly all the combat happens in or just outside the cookie-cutter keeps. This is not the end of the world though because the zones are built. They just need to refine the system.

Actually about 40% of the time in T4 RvR you fight in a Keep/Fortress. The rest of the time the fight is very mobile and typically occurs around choke points and BO's.

Oh and be honest Bread, your not taking a break over that, your just not playing because you get bored of MMO's extremely quickly. Next Big Thing syndrome? ;)

[Hovis]

Oh and be honest Bread, your not taking a break over that, your just not playing because you get bored of MMO's extremely quickly. Next Big Thing syndrome? ;)

What are you basing that on? Barring WoW, which I really never got on with and picked up pretty late anyway, I can't think of any game I've ditched from boredom or NBTS. I ditched Conan because it was total shit, not because something else came along. To me an MMO is a game that needs months to get the best out of it, if not years, and most that I do play do get at least a year off and on.