Hlstats thoughts

[PariaH]

in this post is a current setting of the hlstats points gained for actions menu (couldnt copy and paste it) was thinking of reducing the enggy points to 2 for a sentry and 1 per item built since its easy to abuse by destroying it. Any other thoughts on changes you would like to see?, you can also add more events so long as it is logged by the game in some form.

[Grillkohle]

Sounds good. Reset the stats as well, and is it possible to adjust the coefficient for points change per point difference?

[PariaH]

bumping this thread , and hoping for a little more input, i've never been keen on the default engy scoring,

my suggested changes are as follows

building sentry - 2 points (from 5)
building dispenser - 1 point (from 5)
building teleporter entrance/exit 1 point (from 2)

hopefully that shouldnt skew the points gain from playing an engy too badly, and vastly reduce the need for us admins to monitor players who simply build /destroy items to gain points.

If anyone else has some valid suggestions let me know?

The other thing we were discussing today was to wipe the stats on a quarterly basis to keep the stats fresh and competitive.

[PharadoX]

Im against lowering it so much bcoz of these facts :
- when you make a SG and it stays there for a looong time + enemies know its there its like n1 dies from it so u don't get points.
- when people teleport u don't get hlpoints and teleports is giving like more points in the stats after pressing TAB than SG kills. I even managed to get loads of times more hlpoints and normal points for killing people with shotgun...

Well my all thoughts together : teleports are more important than SG's after u get one SG staying around just saying *dont come in without uber*.

If i was to change anything it would be :
SG 5 -> 3 points.
Dispenser 5 -> 2 points.
Teleports -> no change.
[ If its possible ] +1 hlpoint each 3 people using teleport.
[ If its possible ] +1 hlpoint each demolish if the building is beeing sapped. I always hear like 3 engies *sappin my teleporter!* and exactly nooone of them use the demolish option. And spy gets +2 points for each destroy ( +2 each sapper ).

[The Slann]

I'm not a great fan of hlstats- I normally type hlx_display 0 as soon as I enter the game, to avoid myself playing for stats alone. The only thing that I dislike is the huge points loss when killed by someone of a lower rank. It being a very public server, there's often a lot of people who don't normally play on there, and therefore have very few points, despite some of them being good players. If I get killed by one, I lose huge amounts of points and gain very few for killing them myself. I'd be in favour of a system of 5 points per kill/4 points per death or something similar. Maybe it would be unbalanced though, I don't know.

[PariaH]

the points are calculated al ittle more complex then that though ;) http://rl.hlstatsx.com/?mode=help#points

the maximum points you can lose is 25 per death(this is the minimum default option), this would have to be either from a weapon with a high modifier (melee) or a massive imblance in ranks(in which case they killed you so obviously they get the reward), even with that in place (i should know i regularly lose 25 points per death) the amount of points gained for things such as dominations/ points defended/rounds won means its possible to still gain points easily even if you are the top ranked player,

if anything im looking at the stats and wanting to make them more competitive by reducing the means of gaining "easy points", and make other classes points gained a little fairer (having played scout 3 days in succesion, its alot more fragile in hlstats than a turtling engy) even with the same kpd.

[PariaH]

[ If its possible ] +1 hlpoint each 3 people using teleport.
[ If its possible ] +1 hlpoint each demolish if the building is beeing sapped.

unfortunately from the logs i dont see that "player x used player Y's teleport" being tracked as an event, same for the demolish.

[HeadHunter]

the stats are fine, apart from maybe the points you loose in death.

Also :eek: at that say no to 2fort pic

[PharadoX]

That's why i added the [ If its possible ] :p

Tho i think making a good places teleport that can be used constantly is better toget hlstats for then placing it in a shitty middle of map where any random medic can destroy it , after that the guy builds another one ... and one more... and he's suppsed to get more points for that instead of a good placed teleporter? Fail. :rolleyes:

[Kampf]

why is eaven a rocketkill wotth more than havykill?

[Killswitch]

Thing that annoys me is I'm playing medic and it takes 5-6+ assists without dying to a random rocket from spam before I'm even breaking even now. Don't think anything can be done to change that but still annoying, iI'll just make sure I stay with someone who protects me.

In regards to engineers is it possible to maybe increase there point per kill to 3 or something to compensate. Then at least you can't abuse and get more points for playing more actively.

[Genya Arikado]

Scouts Bat needs to be on the same points modifier as other melee weapons, the damage from the Scout Bat was lowered in a patch a while back and no changes were made to reflect this.

ZOMGBUTSCOUTSCANGETUPCLOSEEASY!

Yes, but it takes quite a few hits to take anyone out now, normal melee is around 1-3 hits to kill someone of average health, and batting is more like 2-6. While it easy to get up close and personal with the scout, it isnt easy staying alive for that many hits with the loud BONK BONK BONK noise alerting the victim.

Perfect example of Engineer points:

Pãtrîäŗčħ

1. Demoman 286 times 58.25%
2. Engineer 260 times 52.95%

Rank: 2
Points: 20,409

Kills: 3,634 (3,521)
Deaths: 1,781

2. Built Object - Dispenser 594 times 2,970
3. Built Object - Sentrygun 585 times 2,925
5. Built Object - Teleporter Exit 541 times 1,082
6. Built Object - Teleporter Entrance 325 times 650


So building shit over 250 odd spawns nets you 7500 points.

Compare that to mine:

Kills: 8,733 (2,822)
Deaths: 5,490
Points: 11,108

Engineer 40 times 5.52%
Built Object - Sentrygun 52 times 260
Built Object - Dispenser 39 times 195
Built Object - Teleporter Exit 28 times 56
Built Object - Teleporter Entrance 19 times 38

Even Lausus (who I personally have not seen as an engi often) at number 1 has jumped on the Engineer bandwagon, the guy at number 3 plays guess what? Engineer and Demo. His most sidepoints gain? Sentry builds.

I should go engineer more often! ^^ But seriously, as pointed out earlier classes like scouts have shit time getting points, whereas Demomen and Engineers tend to have it piss easy. Cowardly medics also can make a killing.

Even Pharadox's points lately can be also attributed to Engineer playing (though not nearly as spammable as others).

[Twist]

I think its a very good idea to nerf the points given from building to 2.2.1 as you've put in your post, although perhaps increasing the points gained from sentry kills to 3 would be a good idea as well encouraging people to put up more worth while sentry's rather then the shit ones i see constantly.

I'm all for resetting the points every 3months as well


Other then that one think that bugs me is as kampf said a heavy and sniper only get 1 point per kill where as a soldier gets more points for a rocket kill, somethings wrong there, i know snipers get 2points for a head shot but still, with a pyro sat there on 1.8 modifier on flamethrower kills ...:confused:

[PharadoX]

Never knew u get less points if u bat someone... I say its even harder to bat someone that to bonesaw him , lastly i came from back 2 sniper so i wanted to bat one and then maybe the second but hell no! 3 bat hits then they both turn around and kill me with their silly machine guns ... so why should bats give less points? [ even tho i don't care much about points ]

Resseting points is somehow a good idea cuz top10 is not the top Best players but the top of those who play fairly good and long.

Even Pharadox's points lately can be also attributed to Engineer playing (though not nearly as spammable as others).

Yup , i just pwn them hardly with my shotgun.

[Genya Arikado]

Other then that one think that bugs me is as kampf said a heavy and sniper only get 1 point per kill where as a soldier gets more points for a rocket kill, somethings wrong there, i know snipers get 2points for a head shot but still, with a pyro sat there on 1.8 modifier on flamethrower kills ...

Yeah, Snipers and Heavies should be bumped up to something like 1.5 and 1.2 respectively, pyros are fine though.

Demomans remote stickies are currently sat at 1.4 compared to the primarys of 1.3, shouldnt that be the other way around? (possibly reduce them by 1 also so that stickies are on same level as rockets)

[Genya Arikado]

Never knew u get less points if u bat someone... I say its even harder to bat someone that to bonesaw him , lastly i came from back 2 sniper so i wanted to bat one and then maybe the second but hell no! 3 bat hits then they both turn around and kill me with their silly machine guns ... so why should bats give less points? [ even tho i don't care much about points ]

Resseting points is somehow a good idea cuz top10 is not the top Best players but the top of those who play fairly good and long.



Yup , i just pwn them hardly with my shotgun.

Bats modifier = 2, all over melee = 3.

Generalisation incoming:
Top 10 = people that play easy (pointswise) classes and are online at the same time as other high point players only. Myself, I am shafted by playing during 'primetime' and getting shitsticked by randoms who havent even reached the kill counter for scoring. That and my irresistable urges to melee.

[PariaH]

the heavy is the highest scoring class per death - game wide thats probably why the weapon modifier (not points!) is set to 1, from what i've read the scout bat probably needs a little adjustment,

Feedback is good though, i think it would be wise to implent a few changes at a time so i dont royally fuck up the system, so for now comment on the points awarded section http://rl.hlstatsx.com/?mode=help (not weapon modifiers)

so thoughts on sentry /dispenser/teleport kills also? sentry kills are valid but still worth 5 ? dispensers/telports could probably do with a reduction though?

and revenge worth 5? if somone dominated you (5 points) is it valid you get 5 for killing them ?

[Genya Arikado]

Scrap dominations and revenges or stick it at one point.

I dislike that part of the game in that it encourages people to victimize one person over others.

[HeadHunter]

alerting the victim.

Perfect example of Engineer points:

Pãtrîäŗčħ

1. Demoman 286 times 58.25%
2. Engineer 260 times 52.95%

Rank: 2
Points: 20,409

Kills: 3,634 (3,521)
Deaths: 1,781

2. Built Object - Dispenser 594 times 2,970
3. Built Object - Sentrygun 585 times 2,925
5. Built Object - Teleporter Exit 541 times 1,082
6. Built Object - Teleporter Entrance 325 times 650


So building shit over 250 odd spawns nets you 7500 points.



Tbh no offense to Pãtrîäŗčħ but he's not even that good. (At least when i see him anyway) i dont really care about the points im only ever around 6000 -7000 which kinda sucks compared to his 20,409 !

[PharadoX]

I think revenge needs more points as if you got dominated you lost loads of those points to one guy.
Getting a kill back is like a miracle if the guy is really good.

[HeadHunter]

all you have to do is shoot him/her once and some other guy will blow him up for you

[PharadoX]

But then instead of satisfaction u get sometin else. ;)

[Patriarch]

my suggested changes are as follows

building sentry - 2 points (from 5)
building dispenser - 1 point (from 5)
building teleporter entrance/exit 1 point (from 2)



Good, the current points values are way too high and reward spam-building.

The other thing we were discussing today was to wipe the stats on a quarterly basis to keep the stats fresh and competitive.

Also a good idea. Not crucial but worth implementing.


Demomans remote stickies are currently sat at 1.4 compared to the primarys of 1.3, shouldnt that be the other way around? (possibly reduce them by 1 also so that stickies are on same level as rockets)

Bad idea. Killing an enemy 1on1 with stickies is harder than rockets and successful sticky traps require planning and quick reactions. A direct kill with nades is tough and kills from nade spam and rocket spam are comparable. As for switching the values for nades/stickies, I have no problem but don't think it's needed or going to change anything.


Tbh no offense to Pãtrîäŗčħ but he's not even that good. (At least when i see him anyway)
Well, that's your opinion. I (and my stats) disagree with you though, even disregarding the engineer points whines. Of course, it's hard to tell who's really skilled in a noob-friendly game like TF2, but that's a different discussion.


and revenge worth 5? if someone dominated you (5 points) is it valid you get 5 for killing them ?

Domination/Revenge are fine, I'd suggest leaving them alone.


It's worth remembering that stats are fairly meaningless anyway, and reward different classes differently. The best player in the world couldn't top the rankings as a Scout or a Medic so don't waste energy getting annoyed by it. HLstats isn't designed for TF2 and doesn't work particularly well with the game. I see no need for it personally.

[HeadHunter]

:o sorry its just whenever i USED to go on you were near the bottom most of the time. I suspect things have changed now.

[Kampf]

i still think that a havy kill is worth as much as a remotepipe or rocketkill.
and don't agument with any random statistics, if u are not a noob those weapons are equil.

[screech]

Hi i know these pages are a bit old but they held alot of anwsers i have been serchign for myself.

I agree that hlstats for tf2 isint that great but if its possable to change all the atributes isint it then possable to coem up with a great balanced hlstats system? instead of lowering everythign maybe normal kills from melle guys could be upped so its worth more to be skilled with solders, scouts and heavys. maybe im off base but it would be nice to have balanced stats that actually show plyers skill.

[PariaH]

well the engy - im going to build lots of random crap has been fixed somewhat

We have udapted all HLstatsX Premium accounts and have fixed the so-called "engineer exploit" within the game Team Fortress 2. If engineers destroy their own buildings they will lost the points they have gotten for building the object.


Still it probably rewards badly positioned sentries so they get blown up and you can build another one, but there are always ways to skew stats :)